(3) With the advent of cyberspace, and just simple disinterest many newspaper companies have gone under. He's eventually discovered and forced to remove his mask but is saved from a bleak fate by another masked woman who tried to warn him to leave earlier. My extra-fat dictionary yields the following: "rhi'zome, n. A rootlike stem under or along the ground,ordinarily in a horizontal position, which usually sends out roots fromfrom its lower surface and leafy shoots from its upper surface.". Yes, and we could speculate even further: there are no dream sequenceswhatsoever in the film, Alice's story about the navel officer being arecollection of her past desires, not a portrayed dream as such atall. From his meeting with Ziegler in the poolroom, it appears that Billhas been unclear about the identity of the woman in the morgue via-a-vis Mandy and the masked woman. Much as you often dream of people, in a distorted way, whom you met while awake. I am normally the last guy in the, > world to criticize somebody for using big words. The (unnamed) woman in the mask who warns > Doctor Cruise is the same woman who ends up dead in the morgue. it is clearly the same voice as the "mysterious woman." Nevertheless, those two recollections(one of a fantasy, one of a dream) constitute the very desire whoseexclusion (from the quotidian, commonsensical, 'social reality' of theHarfords' marriage) the film is exploring. Barcaluv. > > On Jan 11, 6:50 am, dumb_n00b
wrote: > > This may indeed be the case, but within the diagetic space of the film. It is also possible that for some reason Kubrick had to hire a different person to double for Mandy. I found them both disappointing. Eyes Wide Shut is a 1999 erotic mystery psychological drama film directed, produced and co-written by Stanley Kubrick. Clearly, of course,the Somerton ritual is a mirror of Ziegler's party (with each event inmany ways serving as the 'truth' of the other): whether its Mandy atthe party or at the ritual or at both, the outcome is still the same:a corpse in a morgue. No comments. Alot was going on, he had to figure it out. Whereas atSomerton, Ziegler and the others only first become suspicious of Billas an interloper because of how he arrived there (in a taxi ratherthan a limousine). ", http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIXuHaaz5iU, > This may indeed be the case, but within the diagetic space of the film. WebSynopsis. He wasn't positive. Being "all a Charade," doesn't mean it was all a dream. WebIn Kubrick's Eyes Wide Shut, the protagonist Bill arrives at a secret party/orgy: Shortly after arriving, he is warned by a masked woman to leave ASAP. Somerton could hardly be> >>>>>> described (and>> certainly not by Bill) as a 'party. And if this firgure was Ziegler, why would he subsequentlysend a naked masked woman over to Bill for his benefit? (meaning > the Mysterious woman), ME"So..Victor the woman lying dead at the morgue was the> women at the party, well Victor, maybe i'm missing something > but what kind of Charade ends up with someone dead.". I agree though, he hadnt made a defintiive connection yet. >>>>>>>>>>>>And didn't Ziegler subsequently admit that the Somerton people> only learned of Bill's identity as a result of becoming suspicious of> his manner of arrival and the costume-rental receipt in his coat> pocket?<<<<<<<<<<<<<, > So maybe they were all wearing walkie talkies under those masks, what do, > you want me to say?..no, this IS left as a huge mystery. Much of what we have seen is Bill's non-verbal reactions to all this, which is full of shock and bewilderment. Same voice. But then again when Superman puts on a pair of plain eyeglassesLois Lane, or anyone else fails to recognize him as Clark Kent! On Feb 26, 3:27 pm, "Avoid normal situations. >>>>>>>>If this were really thecase, wouldn't Bill have recognised that voice when speaking to themasked woman at Somerton, instead of asking her "Who are you?" But what he was getting at was whether it was murder and a sacrifice for him, which makes him feel responsible, since it would not have happened had he not been there. Bill is still even denying he knows what Zeigler is talking about till Zeigler says "I was there at the house. And isn't this the mistake that many of the film'scritics made, reading Ziegler's story as 'ruining' the mystery,desublimating the film's narrative by means of an all-neat-and-tidydenouement? Let's get out of here.You're my witness. When Bill asks what, she simply responds, "Fuck." Eyes Wide Shut developed after Stanley Kubrick read Arthur Schnitzler's Dream Story in 1968, when Kubrick was looking for a project to follow 2001: A Space Odyssey. Kubrick was interested in adapting the story, and with the help of journalist Jay Cocks, bought the filming rights to the novel. 2. EWS was potential. But it is obvious from Kubrick's portrayal of Somerton that thewomen are there purely as sex-workers, are there toservice the inner sanctum of male patriarchy in the ritualized desire-space of the power elite at Somerton. Ironically, that is just what power (and Ziegler)would want you to believe - that the world of power and power elitesdoesn't exist, is just all a charade anyway, that those who dorecognise the realities of social power and of desire are justparanoid conspiracy nutters (when in fact it is those whoattribute all that occurs in the film to 'a dream' who are beingproperly paranoid). [Some irrelevant pseudo-Buddhist gibberish snipped]. And if it's *not* supposed to be obvious, thatmeans that Polanski screwed up. Web1-48 of 339 results for "Eyes Wide Shut Mask" RESULTS Price and other details may vary based on product size and color. and she replies, "Better," and then when Bill says, "you are a very lucky girl," Mandy says, "I know." "My Sex Slave video with Chinese subtitles"http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjMIROKzH7s, ZKD 788-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4N4vSijHTM, Im Treibhaus (Wesendonck Lieder) - Richard Wagner - Faynehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOhxWdGuQd4, When he claps his hands together. Please either stop > or> shape up. >Apparently word of Bill's entry into the ceremony/orgy traveled fast. Here was Stanley Kubrick, for many the worlds greatest living filmmaker, returning with his first finished project in 12 years a sexually provocative adult drama, utterly shrouded in secrecy, starring pre-eminent Hollywood power couple Tom That is a possible explanation. One intriguing reading of the Eyes Wide Shutmask being on the pillow is that it's only in Bill's head as if he's exhausted by trying to hide his attempts at infidelity or true feelings from Alice, leading to an emotional breakdown. at the > ceremony/orgy. Mandy was not the same woman. > Simply because we don't really know the extent of the "charade," from the > Illuminatii/Secret government etc, OR what SK really had in mind---to blow > our mind. In Eyes Wide Shut, Abigail Good plays a `Mysterious Woman'. For instance,it's fairly obvious from the start who the Mysterious Woman is. and then Bill says, "..you can't keep doing this," Mandy says, "Ya." And the Somerton ritual is alsoambiguous; how, or rather why, for instance, does the masked womanupon first meeting the masked Bill, assert with such certainty that"You shouldn't be here", then followed by repeated warnings that hiscontinued presence at the ritual will get him in trouble? Harry, you are calling him a troll for criticizing your manic, vain and pretentious word salad? If he wereZiegler, wouldn't he instead be going out of his way to privatelycommunicate with Bill, to get Bill out of Somerton as quickly aspossible in order to avoid any possible trouble (and as Zieglersubsequently admits, Bill's gate-crashing 'made me look like acomplete fool')? >> If we speculate too far then we could say it was ALL a Charade.>>, >>>>>>>>>>>That would not be valuable or insightful speculation, but a total> denial of most of what happens in the film (another variation of 'it's> all just a dream', everything being attributable to the delusions of> Bill's mind, a denial of the world of social power, similar to saying> that everything that happens to Jack Torrance in The Shining is all> 'in his mind'). in fact if you look very closely, Mandy on the Slab, winks. WebThat particular Royal event featured masked women who were as NOT dressed as those in the Eyes Wide Shut ritual. The movie went through post-production following Stanley Kubrick's death, though some have argued about how much it represents his intended vision. But examine the frame showing the overhead shot in the morgue, with all the shots of Mandy in the bathroom. 20 years ago today, the final masterpiece from the late, great Stanley Kubrick arrived in theaters. However, as we might imagine, there were many who believed his death was far from natural. <<<<<<<<< But the credits have Abigail Good as> "mysterious woman" and Julienne Davis as Mandy. >>Bill was not yet sure it was Mandy from the bathroom, till he happened to >>see the news story and saw the name "Amanda," then it started to come >>together.>, > These last points I've already covered>. This website has Julienne Davis listed with photos--in all three scenes! WebSleep Mask for Women, Eye Mask for Sleeping Blindfold Block Out Light and Relieves Dry Eyes with Extra Gel Beads Pad,Super Smooth and Flower Patterns 4.4 4.4 out of 5 stars Tragically it was the director's final film with Kubrick dying less than a week after screening an incomplete cut for the studio and its stars. Other interpretations are floating around, including the idea Alice was also at the party, and while there's no set meaning for how the mask got on that pillow, the idea Alice put it there herself seems to be the prevailing theory. There are many aspects of it that ARE still a > mystery such as I was suggesting with the costume. Desire is always the desire of theOther our dreams constituring the realisation of desire. Please either stop or> shape up. (and i'm sure that doesn't even begin to label them in full) They were nutcases. If it'ssupposed to be obvious, then why is it treated as such a great revelation,and why is a character who is presented as being reasonably intelligentso dense as not to see it? In a case like that a pwerson would go through the various possibilities in his mind, but he was kinda busy. >>Even in the morgue he still might not have been positive, but he replays >>her voice in his head while looking over the body. http://groups.google.com/group/alt.movies.kubrick/browse_frm/thread/16629c3d6011a459/705fb749859063b2?lnk=gst&q=treadmill#705fb749859063b2. I mean hewas filmed only in england, but the photography behind him in thatglove clapping shot is projected or whatever and so that means that hedidn't care that mucha bout switching things around like actresses andstuff, it's about masks anyway the movie is. :>released around the same time, The Ninth Gate. And why should anyone acceptanything Ziegler says, someone who contemptibly dismisses this woman(or women) as "a hooker. But that's not the half of it. Again, how is it 'clearly' the same voice? That is what she was" implying that her death> is of no consequence because of the low-status manner in which Ziegler> chooses to define her (an identity created and perpetuated by the> Zieglers of the world in the first place), earlier confirmed by his> desire to get the drugged-out Mandy out of his bathroom and house> ("Can we put some clothes on her and get her out of here?" Take another listen. >> First of all, Mandy must have felt some connection with Bill since he >> was showing her concern and kindness in the Bathroom.>, > Bill in that scene was simply behaving as a (not very) professional> doctor; and he seemed just as concerned about Ziegler's anxiety than> about Mandy's actual wellbeing. Well thats all true, but of course that was SK making a masterpiece and one of the most amazing films ever made IMO. >>>>>>>>>> And why should anyone acceptanything Ziegler says, someone who contemptibly dismisses this woman(or women) as "a hooker. One intriguing reading of the Eyes Wide Shut mask being on the pillow is that it's only in Bill's head as if he's exhausted by trying to hide his attempts at infidelity or true feelings from Alice, leading to an emotional breakdown. I enjoy the > mystery entirely and will return to it over and over and could watch the > film again and again.>, >>>>>>>>>>>>> And if this firgure was Ziegler, why would he subsequently> send a naked masked woman over to Bill for his benefit? He obtains the secret password to a clandestine masked ball, where he has a seductive encounter with a beautiful stranger. The silence of the empty mind, like the silent empty space we see in 2001, is the best path to curing your mania. >>>>>>>>>>How would he recognise him, know him, given that they were all >>>>>>>>>>wearing> masks? He wasn't positive. >>He also must have recognized the voice, considering that her voice is >>somewhat deep and throaty with a tinge of distinctive accent. > Even Sk was not perfect in that way-----or was hethere is another > mystery. The vagueness is intentional, but I think it is clear that it was Mandy all along, although apparently there was a body double for some scenes. It would be odd for him to say, "orgy," or ritual, > etc. Crumb Eye. And coming from the newsgroup'sresident acid-headed, solipsistic zombie. <<<<<<<<<<<>. -- Steven L.Email: sdli@earthlinkNOSPAM.netRemove the NOSPAM before replying to me. - Zieglerwasn't concerned about her health, just eager to get rid of her so asto avoid any potential social embarrassment, "Bill, this is justbetween us"). <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<, > It's "clear," after studying the film after many viewing.>, > <<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Ziegle'sr story here once again, and then retrospectively> interpellating and internalising it, re-interpreting all the earlier> events of the film in strict accordance with his frankly deeply> suspect account? Deleuze probably realized how stupid he was before he jumped out that window. 0. But then, Ziegler's 'explanation', his retconningof past events, only serves to further propel Bill into subjectivedestitution, another 'replay' of Bill's unmasking at Somerton, Zieglerpower-presiding over Bill's position and status at a red pool-tablemuch like Red Cloak presided over the power ritual on a red carpet atSomerton. The genre of Stanley Kubricks last film, based on the well-known story of the Austrian A. Schnitzler, The Novel of Dreams (1925-1926), can be interpreted in different ways. And wouldn't he really feel more at home in amore errrrrrrrr Gnostic setting? But what he was getting at was whether it was > murder and a sacrifice for him, which makes him feel responsible, since it > would not have happened had he not been there. Perhaps itwould have worked better if there had been a photo in the newsarticle. Like much of the director's work like The Shining, movie fans love to debate the symbolism and meaning of Eyes Wide Shut. > Well I hope you see now that this is clear after reading the dialogue. Next: The Shining: Why Stanley Kubrick Changed Stephen King's Story. Was she the women at the party?" And isn't this the mistake that many of the film'scritics made, reading Ziegler's story as 'ruining' the mystery,desublimating the film's narrative by means of an all-neat-and-tidydenouement? SoZiegler's principal role in the film and in this scene is as anunscrupulous defender of wealth and power and as a power-brokerintermediary (laying down the Law while also routinely transgressingit), threateningly indicating to Bill just what the rich and powerfulcan do and what they can get away with. > it is clearly the same voice as the "mysterious woman." at the> ceremony/orgy. In a > case like that a pwerson would go through the various possibilities in his > mind, but he was kinda busy. This is Eyes Wide Shut revisited. WebDirected by Stanley Kubrick Writing Credits Cast (in credits order) verified as complete Produced by Music by Jocelyn Pook Cinematography by Larry Smith (lighting The masks worn in the Eyes Wide Shut orgy scene are from Venetian carnivals; a reputation of civil disorder, moral debauchery and ritualized eroticism. Orgy? Superman movies must keep him in the pre 80s, or he needsto do some serious upgrading. He had no reason to think Zeigler was at Somerton, > till Zeigler tells him. >>In a big crowd of masked people, Zeigler (his eyes give away who he is)>, > So why didn't Bill also recognise the identity of this masked figure> on the basis of his eyes?<<<<<<<<<<<<, > This is simple. You know perfectly well what was meant, Mr Glib Pedant but if youwant to Labour on it, as opposed to labor on it >> [ more stuff snipped ]>> > Similarly, when Bill reads the media report about an Amanda Curran> > suffering a drug overdose in a hotel, why does he immediately make a> > connection with his own recent experiences (and in a coffee shop/cafe> > that set-wise is actually the very same building that earlier served> > as Millich's Rainbow Fashions)? Which all suggests that Ziegler didn't actually knowabout Bill's presence at Somerton until he removed his mask <<<<<<<<<<<<. We need some upstart director and SK devotee who can channel SK, to Make EWS part 2. I am normally the last guy in the> world to criticize somebody for using big words. 0. ME> Again. :>I thought this film was much less interesting than the competing film. > The way Zeigler confirms it was Mandy is matter of fact and it isn't as > though Bill seemed surprised at this--even if the audience might still be > confused.>, > 2. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Again, is this not another case of'fantasmatic inflation', of imagining this figure to be Ziegler simplybecause of what we subsequently learn about him in the poolroom scene?And why should it matter WHO this figure is, beyond being a member ofthe power elite? This is Eyes Wide Shut revisited. Congratulations. While Polanski is the master ofparanoia, The Ninth Gate had too many things wrong with it. Those critics of EWS must have been delerious. (meaning the Mysterious woman) "victor the woman lying dead at the morgue was the women at the party, well victor, maybe i'm missing something heyou call it a Charadetell me what kind of Charade ends up with someone dead.". And didn't Ziegler subsequently admit that the Somerton peopleonly learned of Bill's identity as a result of becoming suspicious ofhis manner of arrival and the costume-rental receipt in his coatpocket? >Bill was not yet sure it was Mandy from> the bathroom, till he happened to see the news story and saw the name> "Amanda," then it started to come together. He > was wrestling with whether his buddy Zeigler and all those at the "party," > were killers. >on the balcony looking down at Bill, knows that it is him and nodded to >him. or psychotherapists. Poor pitiful morons that we all are -thank Bog he's put off Nirvana for so long. -Herodotus, You do not have permission to delete messages in this group, Either email addresses are anonymous for this group or you need the view member email addresses permission to view the original message, I thought the woman who ODd at the dance party (Mandy), the woman who, Well, in the interview with "Mandy" - I don't care to look up her name, Here is a youtube video of "Mandy" (Julienne Davis), singing in her band, I sent a message to the YouTube person who hosted those "Mandy" videos if. while walking down one of the NY streets, the background glowsbeautifucally. You saw her volunteer to sacrifice herself so the orgy managers would let Doctor Cruise go free. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<. >Even in the morgue he still might not have been positive, but he replays >her voice in his head while looking over the body. Why would he demand that she take offher mask if this were so? news:47897d0b$0$5129$4c36@roadrunner.com > Harry writes: (seen on google)>> >>> 1. so drugged out as to have been clearly incapable of making sense >> >>> of>>> anything and 2. never actually spoke (just some unintelligible >> mumbling),<<<>, >> No, she clearly says "sorry" to Zeigler when he says "you gave us a scare >> kiddo" and then Bill asks her, "How are you feeling now Mandy?" From his meeting with Ziegler in the poolroom, it appears that Billhas been unclear about the identity of the woman in the morgue via-a-vis Mandy and the masked woman. Obviously in your literal, fundamentalist world, the concepts ofmetaphor and metonomy are similarly too much for you to possiblycomprehend, viz >> I'm sorry, but this has to be said: I'm pretty sure I know what you mean,> but the way you're saying it is silly. "you are going to need some rehab," she says, "I know." Perhaps Alice was already attending these rituals and this was a way to gently break in stuffy and repressed Bill to this new found club and part of his initiation. Well, in the interview with "Mandy" - Julienne Davis. And the redeemer's pubic hair is also trimmed the same. When we see the naked corpse's face from the overhead shot, at first it's hard to tell if it's really Mandy's face, because of the expression and the angle, her combed back hair etc. The 'mystery' is how SHE knows that he is an interloper. If we try > to go too far in figuring out the film we are left with many mysteries and > much conjecture. WebEyes Wide Shut is Stanley Kubricks love letter to his wife. WebEyes Wide Shut (1999) Abigail Good: Mysterious Woman, Masked Party Principal Showing all 3 items Jump to: Quotes (3) Quotes Mysterious Woman : Stop! I think this feeling of > guilt and outrage at a murder, would be the first thing on his mind. 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